Why can't it be possible we just have had (mostly) poor coaches?

Question

I keep hearing that I dog all our coaches, too negative, etc.

But look at what happened with each of the coaches i supposedly 'dogged':

1) Fulmer - fired, no one else will hire him
2) Green - ditto
3) Buzz - fired, now toiling in obscurity

I never dogged pearl. Made posts about different times when the team wasnt' playing well (or when they were), but never dogged his ability to coach. His record vs. UK was abysmal (and this was when UK was not good, mostly), but overall I couldn't deny he did a great job. He had to go after the scandal, though. No choice.

Now we have dooley and martin, neither of whom have been considered for any other major jobs, and both have ~.500 records. Not good enough, but I do agree they both deserve time (Dooley one more year, Martin a couple more).

I don't see how any of this is unreasonable. I'm just not a diehard optimist who lacks amibition for our school.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 1

From Sports Illustrated:
Smartest hire: Cuonzo Martin, Tennessee.
Too many athletic directors make bad hires because they are trying to "win the press conference." Tennessee went the opposite route. The Tennessee fans who are wailing that they didn't land a "big" name are living in an alternate universe. No big name is going to take a job at a program that is under scrutiny by the NCAA.

Martin has a proven track record. He spent eight years as an assistant at Purdue, and in just three years as the head coach at Missouri State he took the Bears from a low end Missouri Valley team to one that won the regular season championship. He has excellent playing credentials from his decorated career at Purdue and his brief stint in the NBA, which will go over well on the recruiting trail. Finally, he is a man of high character, which was revealed through his successful battle with non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma. If Tennessee fans give Martin the support he deserves instead of the derision he doesn't, he will reward them with a winner.

I think they are talking to the Joe Vols of the world.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by D B Cooper a.

Answer 2

This just in from ESPN....

Link: Link

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by Bluetick88.

Answer 3

which, BTW, is laughable at best and pathetic at worst.

Fulmer was a good coach here for several years. Did you make the call on him in 1992?

I have never seen anyone claim Green was a good coach, so here, your exposing your ignorance all over again

I will bet you didn't dog Buzz until after the first year.

You're wrong on Cuonzo. It's that simple.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by howardwood.

Answer 4

I haven't seen your credentials.

Ray Mears, Don DeVoe, Kevin O'Neil, Bruce Pearl and Cuonzo Martin are all good coaches.

Neyland, Dickey, Majors and Fulmer were all good coaches

Seems like we've had good coaches MOST of the time instead of poor coaches most of the time.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by howardwood.

Answer 5

That message was not approved by Joe Vols.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by D B Cooper a.

Answer 6

Now that would be a kick in the balls to Joe if that happens.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by D B Cooper a.

Answer 7

I'm accused of being negative, when all I've done is criticize coaches who ended up being fired and no one else wants.

As for Cuonzo, we will see. I suspect I'll be right on him the way I was on the others. But hopefully I'll be wrong.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 8

but of course no actual results. Took me four years to educate people on him.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 9

Now we have dooley and martin, neither of whom have been considered for any other major jobs, and both have ~.500 records.

That's interesting since it was reported Martin was being considered, and was contacted, by Mizzou about the same time he accepted the UT job. And the reason he was considered a hot candidate for a big time HC position was because he took Mizzou St from a conference bottom dweller to conference champion in 3 seasons.

Not good enough, but I do agree they both deserve time (Dooley one more year, Martin a couple more). I don't see how any of this is unreasonable.

Stating it that way is NOT unreasonable. But that is not how you have been stating it.

I'm just not a diehard optimist who lacks amibition for our school.

Aaand, Joe is quickly back to Joe.

Dread

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by ZuiderZee.

Answer 10

Buzz got a lot of positive 'buzz' his first season because he was one of Dean's boys, but it was obvious early on he wasn't the right guy for the job. While I couldn't stand Jerry Green, he did have talent, and UT always won at least 20 game per season during his tenure, he just never could get very far in the NCAA tourney. Buzz was unable to do anything w/ Green's talent. I think his best season was a 17-win season. And I don't remember you educating me at all on him.

Dread

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by ZuiderZee.

Answer 11

Actually he wasn't considered by mizzou. That was a surprise to the martin people. Mizzou made a different hire and are tearing it up.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 12

Shows you have some agenda. Show some objective logic. ie; You want to knock Fulmer's entire career, but look at the number of games he won. It is'nt every coach out there that's won 150 games. And then you'll glow about a guy who's done nothing more, less actually, and play it off like its because of where he coaches(Iowa). LOL! Do you really think its any easier to recruit to the Tennessee hills than it is to the corn fields? That's no excuse. Wake me up when he's done something and stop licking his arse for a change.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 13

Actually he wasn't considered by mizzou. That was a surprise to the martin people. Mizzou made a different hire and are tearing it up.

I suspect Martin would be 'tearing it up' at Mizzou as well considering the program Mike Anderson left Haith. Anderson won 77 games his last 3 seasons, including leading the Tigers to the only 30 win season in the school's history, and actually did have some serious talent returning. Martin could have only been so lucky. And yes, he was considered by Mizzou. They chose to go with Haith. It was a good hire. So was Martin.

Dread

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by ZuiderZee.

Answer 14

You mean, is it easier to recruit a kid to a school with better tradition, better facilities, far bigger stadium, more fan support, better competition, better climate? Um....yeah.

This urge on the part of UT fans to down their own school is odd. Maybe you're the bama fan.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 15

Sort've a wash Joe. It's bigtime football at all these schools, some schools just do it better. If Nebraska can recruit Iowa should...not my problem.

And I'm not downing UT, Knoxville has a lot to offer. But its still a tough thing to do to try to sell a kid on leaving his state. TN doesnt have the luxury of some of these other schools. Coaches have to be ready to work harder and longer at recruiting.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 16

on the better competition one. It's harder to recruit to iowa than UT. Period. Not even sure why you're still obsessing over ferentz even after fulmer has been utterly discredited....or maybe that's the reason?

And why is it that recruiting out of state is an excuse for UT coaches but not OU's? Everyone discounts stoops' disadvantage in this area when trying to claim that fulmer is better (can't believe we've even debated that one).

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 17

What did I ignore? The facilities and bigger stadium? Uhhhh, why doesnt Iowa upgrade? There's a lot of schools in remote areas but selling playing against Mich and Ohio State and possibly Rose Bowls should be a pretty good sell. It would for me. It's not like the Big10 is all that hard to win imo.

Stoops is a better coach Joe but as far as recruiting goes he recruits Texas just like all the other Okl coaches have done. Thats how Okl stays good. Texas kids dont seem to mind going to Okl much like the oddity of Ohio kids not minding going to Michigan and vice-versa. I've just always gotten a chuckle out of Stoops and Okl getting plastered the way they do on the big stage. It's funny to me.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 18

he's doing with Martin. He just hopes he's right which is pretty pathetic when you think about it. Such a great UT fan to hope a coach fails so he can be right. And that's true otherwise he would'nt have been negative after 1/2 a season...that's transparent agenda. Martin has as good a track record as any 4th or 5th year coach can have really. He's only had one stop and there was marked improvement record-wise each year. I'd have preferred to see a 5-6 year snapshot to get a better idea of recruiting and winning with his recruits but his records there showed he and his coaches improved the overall performance of the team whether most were his or not. Ive seen coaches take over a great team and do worse with it. Buzz did that in Tulsa.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 19

nm

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 20

they're all just lucky guesses!

It's not bragging, really. It's not that difficult to assess a coach's ability as long as you're doing it objectively.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by JoeVols.

Answer 21

Cal and Joe's head's would explode.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 22

That's just trying to be the first to say it.

In retrospect Green and Raleigh probably were bad hires but Green did win at first, Raleigh never did. Green buried himself with the KMart remark and his Johnnyesque demeanor and contract demands.

With Dooley I gave it til the second season to start voicing displeasure but I was skeptical at first glance because it was a little unnerving that he had'nt done better against WAC competition. I think Ara Parseghian sucked at Northwestern before he got to Notre Dame to. Not exactly equal comparison maybe but I'll go with it anyway.

With Martin you havent seen enough yet to say one way or the other whether its a bad/good/great hire but you're real quick to blame a loss entirely on the coach(es) and conveniently leave out the players inconsistency, which until recently, has been glaring. Still is with a couple of them. I was sure their rankings would shine through at any moment but Martin seem's to be ok with letting the walk-on with the heart fill up the basket and so am I.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by HarveyVolbanger.

Answer 23

Once again you have misremebered. There have only been three coaches fired since Volquest started, Fulmer, Buzz and Pearl. Buzz was a no brainer so that only leaves Fulmer. Quit patting yourself on the back for nothing.

Originally posted on Volquest Chat by D B Cooper a.